Comments on: “Folders are bad” and other urban legends… http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/ After much frustration, it seems DEFAULT is the way to go... Thu, 02 Feb 2012 17:45:46 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Scott Rudy http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-80849 Scott Rudy Mon, 28 Nov 2011 20:22:09 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-80849 I keep reading folders are bad, but they prevent something that metadata doesn't, filename collisions. My client has thousands of documents and many of them have the same name, although the content is very different. As much as I would like to steer them towards metadata I can't find a good way around the naming collisions without sitting down with the users and asking, "What do you want to name this one?", for a few hundred documents. I keep reading folders are bad, but they prevent something that metadata doesn’t, filename collisions. My client has thousands of documents and many of them have the same name, although the content is very different. As much as I would like to steer them towards metadata I can’t find a good way around the naming collisions without sitting down with the users and asking, “What do you want to name this one?”, for a few hundred documents.

]]> By: CleverWorkarounds » Why most SharePoint training doesn’t deliver (and what to do about it) http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-80635 CleverWorkarounds » Why most SharePoint training doesn’t deliver (and what to do about it) Tue, 25 Oct 2011 14:08:41 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-80635 [...] is a product that often requires adaptive change on the part of users. Learning the capabilities of the product is one thing – changing entrenched [...] [...] is a product that often requires adaptive change on the part of users. Learning the capabilities of the product is one thing – changing entrenched [...]

]]> By: Metadata and/ or folders « Out Of The Box Sharepoint (?) http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-79650 Metadata and/ or folders « Out Of The Box Sharepoint (?) Tue, 24 May 2011 13:39:47 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-79650 [...] because of the divers views of participants of using metadata/ or folders. I share with  Paul Culmsee the concerns about the application centric users, they have not the benefit of the added metadata because of the absence of Sharepoint list [...] [...] because of the divers views of participants of using metadata/ or folders. I share with  Paul Culmsee the concerns about the application centric users, they have not the benefit of the added metadata because of the absence of Sharepoint list [...]

]]> By: Esther http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-79453 Esther Tue, 29 Mar 2011 04:37:55 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-79453 Excellent post Paul. I am currently designing a 2007 rollout of about 25 site collections across a lareg corporate team that are migrating from eRoom. Did I mention custom code is out of the question in all shapes and forms? Challenging. I have always been an advocate of using metadata instead of folders in SharePoint and so far this has paid off but I am now seeing this method is not going to work in this case. Using explorer view to drag and drop (a feature these users are more than familiar with in eRoom) creates an enormous bucket of documents and this is not going to be acceptableto end users. So, everything in moderation perhaps (this tends to apply to most SharePoint designs). A mixture of folders and metadata may be what the DR ordered. Excellent post Paul. I am currently designing a 2007 rollout of about 25 site collections across a lareg corporate team that are migrating from eRoom. Did I mention custom code is out of the question in all shapes and forms? Challenging. I have always been an advocate of using metadata instead of folders in SharePoint and so far this has paid off but I am now seeing this method is not going to work in this case. Using explorer view to drag and drop (a feature these users are more than familiar with in eRoom) creates an enormous bucket of documents and this is not going to be acceptableto end users. So, everything in moderation perhaps (this tends to apply to most SharePoint designs). A mixture of folders and metadata may be what the DR ordered.

]]> By: admin http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-75898 admin Tue, 28 Dec 2010 02:49:18 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-75898 Thanks Euguene Watch this space. Early next year I have a series of posts on this topic in a fashion. I agree with your "when", but your "when" is across technical and feature grounds and I think this is half the pictire. I have found another way to look at it that has worked very well in my classes and consulting gigs. regards Paul Thanks Euguene

Watch this space. Early next year I have a series of posts on this topic in a fashion. I agree with your “when”, but your “when” is across technical and feature grounds and I think this is half the pictire. I have found another way to look at it that has worked very well in my classes and consulting gigs.

regards

Paul

]]> By: Eugene Rosenfeld http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-75847 Eugene Rosenfeld Mon, 27 Dec 2010 23:48:45 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-75847 I like how you structure the post from the perspective of user acceptance. I'm of the opinion that both folders and metadata (including content types) have their place in a complete SharePoint information architecture. It is not a question of which one to use, but rather a question of when to use each. As consultants, we have to educate the users as to why it is appropriate to use a folder or metadata in a particular case. The post below compares the trade offs between organizing information with folders and metadata and when it is appropriate to use each: <a href="http://thingsthatshouldbeeasy.blogspot.com/2010/01/sharepoint-folders-vs-metadata.html" rel="nofollow">http://thingsthatshouldbeeasy.blogspot.com/2010/01/sharepoint-folders-vs-metadata.html</a> The comparison categories are security, content type ordering, navigation, url, tools support, searching, sorting, filtering, and grouping. I like how you structure the post from the perspective of user acceptance.

I’m of the opinion that both folders and metadata (including content types) have their place in a complete SharePoint information architecture. It is not a question of which one to use, but rather a question of when to use each. As consultants, we have to educate the users as to why it is appropriate to use a folder or metadata in a particular case.

The post below compares the trade offs between organizing information with folders and metadata and when it is appropriate to use each:

http://thingsthatshouldbeeasy.blogspot.com/2010/01/sharepoint-folders-vs-metadata.html

The comparison categories are security, content type ordering, navigation, url, tools support, searching, sorting, filtering, and grouping.

]]> By: CleverWorkarounds » Un-Managed Metadata: A couple of gotchas http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-56164 CleverWorkarounds » Un-Managed Metadata: A couple of gotchas Thu, 28 Oct 2010 07:17:55 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-56164 [...] 2010 has finally gotten past the use-case I described in my “folders are bad and other urban legends” post. In Office 2010, application centric users have the option to browse document libraries not [...] [...] 2010 has finally gotten past the use-case I described in my “folders are bad and other urban legends” post. In Office 2010, application centric users have the option to browse document libraries not [...]

]]> By: SharePoint 2010 and Folders » Siolon http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-18528 SharePoint 2010 and Folders » Siolon Sun, 29 Nov 2009 19:55:14 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-18528 [...] were people on different sides such as Paul Culmsee who see the issue differently than myself, but the good news is that SharePoint 2010 adds [...] [...] were people on different sides such as Paul Culmsee who see the issue differently than myself, but the good news is that SharePoint 2010 adds [...]

]]> By: admin http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-17901 admin Wed, 04 Nov 2009 14:31:01 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-17901 Hey Andrew Check out this post for a potential answer. http://bdld.blogspot.com/2009_11_01_archive.html On a selfish level, the author linked to me which is nice, but he also quotes Geary Rummler, whos process improvement book that I have mentioned previously. Fully how these things all connect up. Anyway to quote from that link that quotes Rummler, "80% of performance problems reside in the environment, such as processes and systems, so ensure the problem is really a learning/training problem, not some other performance problem" Hey Andrew

Check out this post for a potential answer. http://bdld.blogspot.com/2009_11_01_archive.html

On a selfish level, the author linked to me which is nice, but he also quotes Geary Rummler, whos process improvement book that I have mentioned previously. Fully how these things all connect up.

Anyway to quote from that link that quotes Rummler, “80% of performance problems reside in the environment, such as processes and systems, so ensure the problem is really a learning/training problem, not some other performance problem”

]]> By: Andrew Jolly http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/comment-page-1/#comment-17898 Andrew Jolly Wed, 04 Nov 2009 12:38:41 +0000 http://www.cleverworkarounds.com/2009/09/30/folders-are-bad-and-other-urban-legends/#comment-17898 Nice work on this post Paul, I remember chatting via your Plugoo window on this concept of context and wondered how you'd go at communicating it in a post, you've done a good job. You surface a very good point about people and the way in which they work with information systems, the browser centric or application centric insight you write of is a reality, this futher highlights the importance of training and adoption strategies to build buy in from users, which brings me to the old chestnut of how to convince a organisation not to remove training to reduce the cost of the project. Nice work on this post Paul, I remember chatting via your Plugoo window on this concept of context and wondered how you’d go at communicating it in a post, you’ve done a good job.
You surface a very good point about people and the way in which they work with information systems, the browser centric or application centric insight you write of is a reality, this futher highlights the importance of training and adoption strategies to build buy in from users, which brings me to the old chestnut of how to convince a organisation not to remove training to reduce the cost of the project.

]]>